Distance Closed
I have had some interesting thoughts in my brain lately and thought I might toss ‘em out here ….
Here is one that I have heard for years as I am .. well not really congruent with the sort that the average new age neopagan communities want “hanging around”.
Often I hear the query being expressed as to why certain older paths do not associate with the run of the mill that hold weekends and public rituals and so on. This also goes for why witches don’t run about telling everyone who does what and so on.
Well years ago I expressed just this to Lyn Hume when she was referred onto me by a mutual acquaintance in answer to her request to meet with people to gather information for her upcoming book.
“Let me guess Lyn, no one wants to talk to you do they?”
“Well no and I don’t understand why!”
“It is because you aren’t one of us. We don’t talk to outsiders and are generally even less inclined to talk to people who want to tell the world about what we do.”
In the years since then, I have seen this lack of understanding come of age in some quarters of the neopagan community and totter off on its way. I have heard of Traditional Magisters being told that they should tell what they know and do because “they have a right to know” or even (and gods know how THIS was supposed to ingratiate!) “because you are old and don’t have long to go so you should talk before you die so it continues”.
More to the point I have noted the groundswell of opinion that equates to the notion that closed circles and lines should open up to people who ask – generally simply because they ask. When this does not happen, these circles are generally considered outcast because they will not (to boil it down) do as they are bid.
Oddly enough in many ways these days, no one ever responds to the question: “Why don’t you have stuff to do with us?” with the counter question – “Why SHOULD we?”
I mean seriously! Why SHOULD we? What gain is there in it for us?
I realise that this makes me sound exceedingly mercenary and also quite elitist but I don’t really mind. After all, I suppose I AM in comparison to most of what is around these days. What I do is not for everyone and it is a manner by which I can get my way as an “edge” on most others; so why would I swap something for nothing? All sentiment aside, does your corner shop just give you things for nothing? I suspect not.
If nothing else, I have been known over the years to voice a standard reply to intimations of requested support with the query: “And what is it exactly that I am expected to support? Support requires something concrete for it to act upon.” More often than not there is nothing specific in reality and the request is not much more than a desire for contact. I find that variants on the query: “to what end precisely?” obviates the parameters and makes clear what should be done next.
The simple facts are that there are many closed circles and lines and that is the way they like it. They have little or nothing in common with the average sort of practitioner about these days. Their goals are not the same, they do not value the same things, nor believe the same things – they further do not work the same way. So why then would they want to “hang out” with their alleged distant cousins with which they share nothing in common?
This to say nothing of the fact that many of the practices considered de-rigueur these days are considered horrifically dangerous, rude or simply ineffectual. The same can be said of their practitioners. Whether this is the case or not in reality is of no consequence, what matters to any individual in their decision making is what they believe – whether it is correct or no. Indeed one sentiment I often hear voiced is: “Why do they do what they do? It makes no sense – I have no time for such dangerous silliness!”
It is pointless to state that in everything is some worth and that they are the poorer for not going out of their way to try – because they aren’t. Motivation is required and those who have what they want are rarely motivated to give it away in favour of another thing which may or may not bear any fruit.
No, the more you examine those who ply every variant on the whole: “They should hang out with us” and so on type thoughts; the more you become aware that their interest lies not in any real wish for companionship or familial contact. It lies instead in their attempts to get something they believe they want that they don’t have and resenting to some degree those they believe DO have it and are denying them.
In this they are generally simply variants on those who sneer at closed groups because they were never invited to join. They often do so with endless variants upon the themes of “closed groups are simply elitist clubs trying to hide their own inadequacies”. If that were the case they would be irrelevant … and if they were irrelevant there would be no point in railing against them would there?
No, those who are looking these days will note that a lot of the older more traditionally styled paths are closing the gates and retreating back into the shadows. I fear that it may well be for the reason that I was given:
“Those who want contact want you to explain it to them. Those who want it explained are not those who you want contact with. You should only talk to those who are your people. If they need it explained then they are not your people after all. There is a world of difference between the questions: “But what does that mean?” and “What name is given to what I am?”
An important distinction – and one which, (I see now) is why I keep my readership small.
Here is one that I have heard for years as I am .. well not really congruent with the sort that the average new age neopagan communities want “hanging around”.
Often I hear the query being expressed as to why certain older paths do not associate with the run of the mill that hold weekends and public rituals and so on. This also goes for why witches don’t run about telling everyone who does what and so on.
Well years ago I expressed just this to Lyn Hume when she was referred onto me by a mutual acquaintance in answer to her request to meet with people to gather information for her upcoming book.
“Let me guess Lyn, no one wants to talk to you do they?”
“Well no and I don’t understand why!”
“It is because you aren’t one of us. We don’t talk to outsiders and are generally even less inclined to talk to people who want to tell the world about what we do.”
In the years since then, I have seen this lack of understanding come of age in some quarters of the neopagan community and totter off on its way. I have heard of Traditional Magisters being told that they should tell what they know and do because “they have a right to know” or even (and gods know how THIS was supposed to ingratiate!) “because you are old and don’t have long to go so you should talk before you die so it continues”.
More to the point I have noted the groundswell of opinion that equates to the notion that closed circles and lines should open up to people who ask – generally simply because they ask. When this does not happen, these circles are generally considered outcast because they will not (to boil it down) do as they are bid.
Oddly enough in many ways these days, no one ever responds to the question: “Why don’t you have stuff to do with us?” with the counter question – “Why SHOULD we?”
I mean seriously! Why SHOULD we? What gain is there in it for us?
I realise that this makes me sound exceedingly mercenary and also quite elitist but I don’t really mind. After all, I suppose I AM in comparison to most of what is around these days. What I do is not for everyone and it is a manner by which I can get my way as an “edge” on most others; so why would I swap something for nothing? All sentiment aside, does your corner shop just give you things for nothing? I suspect not.
If nothing else, I have been known over the years to voice a standard reply to intimations of requested support with the query: “And what is it exactly that I am expected to support? Support requires something concrete for it to act upon.” More often than not there is nothing specific in reality and the request is not much more than a desire for contact. I find that variants on the query: “to what end precisely?” obviates the parameters and makes clear what should be done next.
The simple facts are that there are many closed circles and lines and that is the way they like it. They have little or nothing in common with the average sort of practitioner about these days. Their goals are not the same, they do not value the same things, nor believe the same things – they further do not work the same way. So why then would they want to “hang out” with their alleged distant cousins with which they share nothing in common?
This to say nothing of the fact that many of the practices considered de-rigueur these days are considered horrifically dangerous, rude or simply ineffectual. The same can be said of their practitioners. Whether this is the case or not in reality is of no consequence, what matters to any individual in their decision making is what they believe – whether it is correct or no. Indeed one sentiment I often hear voiced is: “Why do they do what they do? It makes no sense – I have no time for such dangerous silliness!”
It is pointless to state that in everything is some worth and that they are the poorer for not going out of their way to try – because they aren’t. Motivation is required and those who have what they want are rarely motivated to give it away in favour of another thing which may or may not bear any fruit.
No, the more you examine those who ply every variant on the whole: “They should hang out with us” and so on type thoughts; the more you become aware that their interest lies not in any real wish for companionship or familial contact. It lies instead in their attempts to get something they believe they want that they don’t have and resenting to some degree those they believe DO have it and are denying them.
In this they are generally simply variants on those who sneer at closed groups because they were never invited to join. They often do so with endless variants upon the themes of “closed groups are simply elitist clubs trying to hide their own inadequacies”. If that were the case they would be irrelevant … and if they were irrelevant there would be no point in railing against them would there?
No, those who are looking these days will note that a lot of the older more traditionally styled paths are closing the gates and retreating back into the shadows. I fear that it may well be for the reason that I was given:
“Those who want contact want you to explain it to them. Those who want it explained are not those who you want contact with. You should only talk to those who are your people. If they need it explained then they are not your people after all. There is a world of difference between the questions: “But what does that mean?” and “What name is given to what I am?”
An important distinction – and one which, (I see now) is why I keep my readership small.
posted by BissekArt at 11:51 am
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